Thursday, December 22, 2011


From: "Kevin Trenberth" <>
Subject: Re: urban heat island - since 1950? or since 1900
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2007 20:24:35 -0600 (MDT)

seems like we should do the same if we can in our galley proof.

> Phil
> Thanks for your reply. I have removed the
> 'since 1950' from the TS. That was taken from
> your ES but in view of this discussion I think
> the reader needs to go to the chapter.
> Please note that 'Since 1950' is not (and never
> was) in the SPM, so there is no interplay at all
> between the issues being discussed in this series
> of emails and anything that occurred in Paris or
> prior to Paris.
> It was, of course, for you to decide what you
> wanted in your ES and how to mesh that with the
> main text of your chapter. It is entirely a
> 'within chapter' issue.
> best regards,
> Susan
> At 4:30 PM +0100 4/10/07, wrote:
>> Susan, Kevin,
>> See attachment, I realise this is an important issue,
>>as this wil be one of the areas the skeptics will go over
>> with a fine toothcomb. I'm happy either way - either
>> with the since 1950 or without. I've explained why it is
>> there.
>> I'm back in CRU tomorrow am. I'm also
>> away on Sunday for the next 2 weeks, so if there is more
>> to resolve, we need to do this by Friday.
>> Cheers
>> Phil
>>> Kevin,
>>> Thanks for thinking about this. Based on the chapter referencing
>>> Brohan and explicitly saying 1900 regarding the 0.006/decade figure
>>> which is what is used as the bottom line, I wonder if this is a typo
>>> and since 1950 should perhaps be since 1900 in your ES.
>>> The same thing occurs in the TS, and I am checking page proofs for
>>> that which is why I got to wondering and checked back in chapter 3,
>>> where I found this conundrum. If it is correct as 1950, fine, but
>>> it doesn't look like that to me.
>>> I'll wait to hear from Phil, hopefully tomorrow.
>>> bests,
>>> Susan
>>> At 5:28 PM -0600 4/9/07, Kevin Trenberth wrote:
>>>>This is Phil's territory so I'll leave to him to follow up further. Are
>>>>you suggesting that something should change? Seems to me that maybe
>>>>removing the "(since 1950)" from ES might help? I am on travel rest
>>>> of
>>>>the week.
>>>>> Kevin
>>>>> Thanks for your reply.
>>>>> I am referring to the final distributed draft chapter, which was
>>>>> before
>>>>> Paris.
>>>>> Your ES pre-Paris (and post-Paris) says 1950 but this seems
>>>>> inconsistent with the text of your pre-Paris chapter, where the
>>>>> hemispheric and global values are given, and post-1900 is stated at
>>>>> that point. The value of 0.006 is clearly associated with
>>>>> post-1900
>>>>> in the text.
>>>>> I don't think that this has anything to do with the clarifications
>>>>> to
>>>>> what was meant regarding UHI that were made in the SPM at Paris.
>>>>> The
>>>>> question is a lack of consistency in the pre-Paris chapter's ES and
>>>>> main text.
>>>>> Please consult your final draft chapter and let me know.
>>>>> bests
>>>>> Susan
>>>>> At 3:18 PM -0600 4/9/07, Kevin Trenberth wrote:
>>>>>>Phil is best to answer this. You may recall this was fiddled with
>>>>>>after Paris and the values cited from 1900 were inserted at that
>>>>>>stage based on one study. Earlier in the text you will see that
>>>>>>most studies are from 1950 on: including those of Parker 2004, 2006,
>>>>>>Li et al 2004, etc, and the DTR, Tmax and Tmin are given in Fig 3.2
>>>>>>only after 1950; those are indicators also. So in the ES we refer
>>>>>>to the several studies since 1950 but the value cited does indeed
>>>>>>refer to the period since 1900. Phil would have to say whether
>>>>>>this could be changed: certainly, with current wording it explicitly
>>>>>>calls out the studies of the post 1950 period and would not be
>>>>>>appropriate to change to 1900.
>>>>>>My sense is that the awkwardness comes from the late edit.
>>>>>>Susan Solomon wrote:
>>>>>>>Kevin and Phil,
>>>>>>>In checking over some text, I noted a statement in your ES that UHI
>>>>>>>effects are negligible, where since 1950 is indicated as the
>>>>>>>temporal period of application. In the text of the chapter, it
>>>>>>>looks more like 1900 to me. Should this be 1950, or 1900? or
>> >>>>>something else?
>>>>>>Kevin E. Trenberth e-mail:
>>>>>>Climate Analysis Section,
>>>>>>P. O. Box 3000, (303) 497 1318
>>>>>>Boulder, CO 80307 (303) 497 1333 (fax)
>>>>>>Street address: 1850 Table Mesa Drive, Boulder, CO 80305
>>>>Kevin Trenberth
>>>>Climate Analysis Section, NCAR
>>>>PO Box 3000
>>>>Boulder CO 80307
>>>>ph 303 497 1318
>>Attachment converted: Junior:urbanizationESTS.doc (WDBN/�IC�) (00167B2F)

Kevin Trenberth
Climate Analysis Section, NCAR
PO Box 3000
Boulder CO 80307
ph 303 497 1318

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